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RoyalJim click here to view user rating
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"Hillary's strategy is working"
 
   LAST EDITED ON 14-May-08 AT 12:23 PM (PST)
 
http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0508/10334.html

Obama defeat amplifies race, rural problems
By BEN SMITH | 5/13/08 10:26 PM EST

Barack Obama’s stinging defeat in West Virginia brings a sharp focus on the new coalition he may have to assemble to win the White House in November.

West Viginians rejected the presumptive Democratic nominee by more than a two-to-one margin, one of the widest margins of the primary season. The outcome was the predictable result of familiar demographics: West Virginia’s relatively poor white voters have been Hillary Rodham Clinton’s base since February.

In a stark rejection of Obama in a state Bill Clinton carried in 1992 and 1996, almost half of the Democratic primary voters — typically the most partisan Democrats in a state — said they’d vote for Republican John McCain rather than Obama in November.

The results also suggested a deeper dissatisfaction among the state’s Democrats with both candidates: John Edwards, who dropped out more than three months ago, registered a substantial 7 percent of the vote, though Clinton immediately used the results to make her own case for electablity.

“I'm more determined than ever to carry on this campaign,” Clinton told a cheering crowd in Charleston, stressing her electablity. “If you give me a chance, Democrats, I’ll come back to West Virginia in the general election, and we’ll win this state, and we’ll win the White House.”

Behind her, a young man waved a bowling pin — a symbol of the cultural distance between Obama, who bowls poorly, and the state’s working-class white voters. Her supporters cheered raucously when numbers showing Clinton’s margin among non-college educated voters flashed on the screen in Charleston.

But with Obama remaining as the likely nominee, the results highlighted the question of exactly how he will beat McCain in November, a question his campaign did not directly address in a memo released a few hours before polls closed.

The memo stressed Obama’s strength in a different group, independent voters.

“Nationally, Obama is running stronger among Independent voters than any winning Presidential candidate since 1988 and is significantly outperforming Sen. Clinton among these voters as well in general election polling,” the memo said.

The memo also dismissed as a “myth” the notion that “Obama cannot perform strongly enough among white voters.”

“Obama ... is running as well or better than past Democratic candidates among white voters,” the memo said, showing he currently holds a share of white support similar to that Al Gore and John Kerry held in their head-to-head contests in 2000 and 2004.

The results on which the campaign is relying indicate that Obama does somewhat better with educated white independent voters than Clinton, making up for his deficit with working-class white voters.

That’s a demographic fact that could change the map in November, pushing Obama’s campaign north and west, and posing problems for him in the crucial rust belt portions of Ohio and Pennsylvania.

Obama aides said Obama called Clinton, but didn’t reach her, after her victory became clear.

But he spent the night in Missouri, and let the West Virginia results pass without comment.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Pay particular attention to this statement:

"In a stark rejection of Obama in a state Bill Clinton carried in 1992 and 1996, almost half of the Democratic primary voters — typically the most partisan Democrats in a state — said they’d vote for Republican John McCain rather than Obama in November."

Hillary is proving to the superdelegates that Obama can not win the general election. HALF of the "most partisan" Democratic primary voters said they would vote Republican instead of for Obama.

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jjaxdaty click here to view user rating
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14-May-08, 12:39 PM (PST)
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1. "RE: Hillary's strategy is working"
In response to message #0
 
   LAST EDITED ON 14-May-08 AT 01:04 PM (PST)
 
Just think what would have happened if Hillary did drop out earlier. The Dem party would not have known about Obama's non-support from certain segments of the Dem party.

But the exit polls statistics which you emphasize is only for W.V., not any of the other states so let's not exaggerate this.

Also, to get a clearer picture you also have to consider the independents and which they will vote. Their numbers will make up for any Dem voters who swing over to McCain.

She exposed something ugly about certain segments of our society. Judging from Obama's success, these are merely pockets of racism and these folks are being left behind as the rest of America movse forward.

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Zejauw69 click here to view user rating
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3. "RE: Hillary's strategy is working"
In response to message #1
 
   "Just think what would have happened if Hillary did drop out earlier. The Dem party would not have known about Obama's non-support from certain segments of the Dem party."

I disagree. Rather it is a wedge that has been exploited and amplified, if not created, by Hillary's campaign as she pivoted from presumptive nominee to desperate, win-at-any-cost underdog. She is doing more damage to the cause by staying in the race and no matter what it won't help her win the nomination. Instead, it likely assures Obama will try and address this segment of the electorate via his VP pick. Will it be enough, as of today I say no, but we shall see.

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jjaxdaty click here to view user rating
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4. "RE: Hillary's strategy is working"
In response to message #3
 
   So you are saying that if Hillary not continued her campaign these voters who say they will not vote for Obama, they would have done so in the general election?

I think not. These folks are racist and there is nothing that Hillary has done to make them more racist.

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SexyMink click here to view user rating
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14-May-08, 12:54 PM (PST)
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2. "RE: Hillary's strategy is working"
In response to message #0
 
   ,Well if that is an old Trick Than Perhaps it is time for some NEW ONES....

The American People will decide in the end who is President...Not the Hillary or McCain.....

WHAT IF? by some FREAK of Political Normacy, OBAMA Defeats McCain by a unpresidented land slide?

What if Hillarys undermining the possiblity of her own Democratic Party Competitor becoming the First Black Man to become president in this fairland fails, like her ability to keep her Husbands Pants up away from Home AND Mr Barak makes US History?

What if the Idealistic minds and hearts of our children who will inherate this mess we have made, pull together people of all Colors Creeds and Nationalites that make up this Country and Pull it off. Voting this Negro into office...Oh and don't forget about all the "OTHERS' who have not really had a voice in this land because they are niether black white asian Island Pacificers or Hispanic...What about those PEOPLE...what if they all come out and support the change needed to get a real Peaceful and Non Violent REVOLUTION going in these great United States of America?....What if Politics as we know them here have run its race and a change is in the atmosphere?


Then What?

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1Freeman click here to view user rating
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15-May-08, 09:32 PM (PST)
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18. "Lots of questions, but do you have any answers? ..."
In response to message #2
 
... just another question!

Great questions, but perhaps you can help us answer a few of them.

Peace,
Juan Freeman

There is but one evil, war. All the other proclaimed evils such as hate, greed, discrimination, and jealousy are only sub-categories of it. - – Jose Barreiro

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BigWanger
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14-May-08, 02:21 PM (PST)
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5. "Go Hillary!"
In response to message #0
 
   Go Hillary!!!

http://images.craigslist.org/0101060103030104062008051401d1e2039697bd8dc6004eb2.jpg

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Durruti click here to view user rating
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6. "RE: Go Hillary!"
In response to message #5
 
  
I guess another articulate West Virginian has made their opinion known.

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jjaxdaty click here to view user rating
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7. "RE: Go Hillary!"
In response to message #6
 
   LAST EDITED ON 14-May-08 AT 04:40 PM (PST)
 
At the beginning of the primaries I didn't give Obama much of a chance because he was half-black.

Even more, I would have more easily believed that Americans have no qualms about hiring or associating with blacks but when it came down to choosing a president that would have been where they would have drawn the line.

Given that he is on the verge of winning the nomination I am pleasantly surprised that there aren't as many racists as I thought.

No matter how this election turns out for Obama, I am heartened that America is further along with race relations than I would have imagined.

Racists will always exist but as a minority view our society will matrch on in spite of these losers. They are the ones who are miserable because so few share their irrational dislikes.

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Jacket1 click here to view user rating
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8. "RE: Hillary's strategy is working"
In response to message #0
 
   LAST EDITED ON 14-May-08 AT 06:48 PM (PST)
 
All this could be avoided if Hillary and Obama would BOTH drop out.

Due to the superdelegate scam, the winner would be selected not elected anyway. By both dropping out, they will spare the party a bruising battle and spare the country from 4 years of backsliding.

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escort4us click here to view user rating
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9. "RE: Hillary's strategy is working"
In response to message #8
 
Spare the drama jacket.

Youre just upset that your chickenhawks are going to take it up the historical ass, and your GOP revolution only took 8 years to rise and completely fall.

Personality traits inform others.

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Jacket1 click here to view user rating
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11. "RE: Hillary's strategy is working"
In response to message #9
 
   Funny, I don't remember Bill, Hillary, or Obama fighting for our country. And Hillary is talking about taking out Iran if they get out of line. Maybe she'll send Bill to boot camp if the superdelegates select her.

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JPB123 click here to view user rating
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10. "RE: Hillary's strategy is working"
In response to message #0
 
You realize that even with Obamas defeat in W.Virginia, he still received more votes than McCain right?

...JPB123

Give GW Bush a 3rd term! Vote for McCain...

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RoyalJim click here to view user rating
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12. "RE: Hillary's strategy is working"
In response to message #10
 
   Yeah ok. The Repubs primary voters had a lot of incentive to turn out. If you add 1/2 the Hillary voters to McCain, what do you get?

If it makes you feel better that the Dems came out more, go ahead, feel good.

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JPB123 click here to view user rating
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13. "RE: Hillary's strategy is working"
In response to message #12
 
Just stating a fact jim. Maybe you are right and the fact that McCain has it all sewn up was why no republicans showed up to support him, but keep in mind...Many, if not most democrats that voted for hillary will come around and peel off to vote for Obama when he is pitted against McCain. There had better be some real turnout for republicans or Obama could get a squeaker just based on the large turnout of democrat voters compared to republicans. Republicans don't seem to be getting any fresh members as of late...

...JPB123

Give GW Bush a 3rd term! Vote for McCain...

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RoyalJim click here to view user rating
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14. "RE: Hillary's strategy is working"
In response to message #13
 
   "Just stating a fact jim."

Yup a useless one at that.


"Maybe you are right and the fact that McCain has it all sewn up was why no republicans showed up to support him,"

I never said that. But think what you want.

"but keep in mind...Many, if not most democrats that voted for hillary will come around and peel off to vote for Obama when he is pitted against McCain."

Interesting you are avoiding the actual facts I presented above from voter turnout. Are you just ignorant of reality? Your statement is diametrically opposed to the research done.

"There had better be some real turnout for republicans or Obama could get a squeaker just based on the large turnout of democrat voters compared to republicans."

Not if half the dems vote for McCain....

"Republicans don't seem to be getting any fresh members as of late..."

Unless you count the disillusioned dems....


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JPB123 click here to view user rating
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15. "RE: Hillary's strategy is working"
In response to message #14
 

>
>
>
> "Republicans don't seem to be getting any fresh members as
>of late..."
>
>Unless you count the disillusioned dems....

I seriously doubt any significant number of disillusioned dems would vote republican. They would vote Nader first so you are wishing for something to happen that isn't going to happen...but hey, keep up the hope...

...JPB123

Give GW Bush a 3rd term! Vote for McCain...

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RoyalJim click here to view user rating
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16. "RE: Hillary's strategy is working"
In response to message #15
 
   "I seriously doubt any significant number of disillusioned dems would vote republican. They would vote Nader first so you are wishing for something to happen that isn't going to happen...but hey, keep up the hope..."

I am not hoping one way or the other. So you deny the accuracy of the polling information?? Just because YOU think it is so, it is?


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ChumpChange click here to view user rating
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17. "RE: Hillary's strategy is working"
In response to message #16
 
   McCain has a lot going for him.
He is a recognized war 'hero' who survived torture, etc.
He has a son serving in Iraq, his father was an admiral.

These facts will appeal to a great segment of the electorate, especially if the politicians can keep the 'fear factor' active.

OTOH, Hilary is a known criminal (known to anyone having above a double-digit IQ), and Obama is becoming recognized as a Black Theology Supremist with an America-hater wife.

Democrats, you have pathetic choices; not that McCain lights me up in any way.

Cc


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JPB123 click here to view user rating
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19. "RE: Hillary's strategy is working"
In response to message #16
 
The election is in november. That is a factor. If the election were next month those poll numbers would worry me...There is a lot of time for those democrats to come to their senses...

...JPB123

Give GW Bush a 3rd term! Vote for McCain...

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