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Subject: "Thanks to those who understand the 'checkpoint' phenomenon" Archived thread - Read only
 
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Reading Topic #17095

westsidebob westsidebob rating
Member since 6-Jul-09
203 posts, 6 feedbacks, 12 points
24-Aug-10, 00:12 AM (PST)
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"Thanks to those who understand the 'checkpoint' phenomenon"
 
   LAST EDITED ON 24-Aug-10 AT 00:17 AM (PST)
 
I purposely stayed out of the fray; I already know what certain people are going to say--I can only shudder at the thought of an America that corresponds to their "we have to get them regardless of the costs" mentality.

But I do want to offer my sincere thanks to those who understand the broader implications that the "checkpoint" phenomenon has on any society that values freedom.

My thanks to Star-169, looney4pooney, shawshank3, BobSapp, Brando_fan, fresnopan, and especially to latinopoet; I've said it before and I'll say it again, you're the man.

RB has some terrific people.

Keep the faith.

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PostNasalDrip
Member since 3-Feb-10
481 posts
24-Aug-10, 03:07 AM (PST)
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1. "RE: Thanks to those who understand the 'checkpoint' phenomenon"
In response to message #0
 
   Well Candi Lightner, and the group she formed call Mothers Against Drunk Drivers, MADD, were the first group which used the "do it for the children" in order to enact legislation.

Laws already existed to arrest drunk drivers at the time, and before that time.

But what she did, was make a standardized test, based on blood alcohol level(BAC), to make it illegal to drive. Not based on your driving ability, or how you were driving, of if you got into an accident. Regardless of one's ability to drive after, say 4 beers.

Shortly later, under the same methodology, the random checkpoints were legislated. That police officers could stop drivers, not based on how they were driving, but randomly, and to test them, and search them against the 4th Amendment(which has never been effectively challenged), randomly for their BAC.

Candi Lightner, and her pretty young blonde haired daughter, have become the model for this type of removal of rights of the People.

"Do it for the children".

You see that same mentality in Law Enforcement's rationale for going after vice. They know that adult human beings should be allowed to consent to any number of things(including prostitution). But they will rationalize their efforts by saying that they are trying to stop "human trafficking" which they have NEVER shown any proof of, or to stop "child prostitution", which rarely ever occurs.

"Do it for the children".

If they could convince middle class housewives, that if they gave up their keys to their homes, that it would insure a better life for their children, they would do it, in a minute.

I would rather trust my chances with at 40 year old, seasoned drunk driver,,, than a 16 year old, or a 65 year old driver.

If cops pulled over little blue haired old ladies, just for being old, can't see over the steering wheel...and gave them a routine field sobriety test...I bet MOST of them would fail.

Yes, I agree, there is no difference between a random checkpoint now, than there was in Germany 70 years ago. Papieren Bitte.

Everyone knows somebody who gets drunk on 1 beer, and everyone knows somebody who can't get drunk after 11 beers.

But, we must "Do it for the children".

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rballs rballs rating
Member since 5-Dec-05
522 posts, 10 feedbacks, 20 points
24-Aug-10, 09:14 AM (PST)
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2. "RE: Thanks to those who understand the 'checkpoint' phenomenon"
In response to message #1
 
   PND, That may be the finest post I have ever read on the subject, I couldn't agree more.

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Shellback97 Shellback97 rating
Member since 27-May-05
3482 posts, 105 feedbacks, 190 points
24-Aug-10, 11:27 AM (PST)
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3. "RE: Thanks to those who understand the 'checkpoint' phenomenon"
In response to message #1
 
I can't help but be reminded of prohibition. Based on what happened after prohibition in this country and it's subsequent repeal a decade later, it is reasonable to conclude that in 1919 the majority of Americans liked to have a drink once in awhile, they just didn't want their neighbors or their minister to know about it, so they allowed a ruthless well organzied minority of zealots to take away their right to drink in the supposedly free and democratic United States of America. No greater miscarriage of democracy exists in our history (well maybe the income tax amendment is worse, since at least prohibition did get repealled).

Now we live in a society where everyone just blinding follows MADD's drumbeat on DUIs without putting in any independent thought to the issue. One would think that the people involved in our lifestyle would be a bit more openminded since we are also victims of the same thought process. Evangelical Christians and Feminazis have done a great job misinforming the average American as to what a bunch of evil people we supporters of responsible prostitution are, and the average American blindly accepts the representations of our biggest opponents without looking into the subject independently.

With regard to current DUI laws, people go to prison for multiple DUIs even if they never even came close to causing an accident - is that right? MADD operates as a business and as such needs to constantly push for tougher laws regardless of weather or not the laws in place are sufficient, and they will continue putting out propaganda that they are insufficent as long as it suits their agenda. DUI fatalities were not changed one bit by the lowering of the BAC limit from .10 to .08. Regardless of this fact, if MADD had it's way the law would in fact be zero tolerance - no one can drive with a measurable amount of BAC. Luckily the push for lower BACs is now getting pushed back by restraunts that serve alcohol. In every DUI vehicular manslaugher case I am aware of the driver was way fucked up...like a BAC of .20 or higher. So really the right approach would be to have much tougher penalties for people driving at .20 or higher, perhaps even making that a felony right out of the gate, and have less harsh penalites for people driving a couple blocks home from the bar after work at a .10. However DUI fines are huge revenue generators for county government and thus they have no incentive to upset the status quo in a way that will promote public safety yet curtail revenue.

As for check points, my knowledge of the political beliefs of the signers of the constitution is such that this is exactly the sort of government intrusion they were trying to curtail when they passed the 4th Amendment to the Constitution. Remember, unlike the vast majority of Americans today, these were all men that actually lived under an oppressive government, and were very concerned about government abuse of power, since they knew first hand the intangible evils such abuse can cause on a society. I find it amazing the supposedly 'strict constructionist' Justices on the US Supreme Court don't see it this way.


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ramfan11111 ramfan11111 rating
Member since 12-Aug-09
539 posts, 11 feedbacks, 18 points
24-Aug-10, 02:33 PM (PST)
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4. "RE: Thanks to those who understand the 'checkpoint' phenomenon"
In response to message #0
 
   When you all get through shinning each others knobs would you care to offer your own solution to the problem of drunk driving? Or do you just want to make your comparisons to Hitlers Germany or cry how we are in jeopardy of losing our civil rights? You can always continue to act as if MADD are just a bunch of crazy women who hide under the bed fearful of life.
People who are critical of the cops and organizations who simply try to make it safer for us all, but offer no ideas or solutions of their own are useless. But you are great at knob shinning!


http://www.alcoholalert.com/drunk-driving-statistics.html

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