www.couragecampaign.org

For others, it's an appetizer- something to lead into (and/or contiune through) the main course.... for others it is everything but dessert.

I've never understood why anyone would want to play with a top who didn't seek a balance between their desires and those of their subs....(although that is just my reference point- and I do understand everyone is wred differently)....

yeah, I know all about topping from the bottom and all that, but for me, finding a sub's desires and going there opens up a larger realm of possibilities- a truer path to surrender, than just indulging myself without regard to them...

for me, BDSM without a, shall we say, sensual component, is like that sundae without the whipped cream and cherry- it can be good, but something is still lacking. YMMV.

Be the change
you wish to see

You did give me something to think about, that from their perspective it's not sexual. Of course, even a hooker likely doesn't always get turned on by straight actual sex. Would that make the act not sexual, because it's a one sided turn on? My preference for a prodomme is one who does indeed consider it sexual. I guess one never knows for sure but sometimes you can just catch a glint in her eye. I really don't want to see a prodomme who doesn't consider prodomination sex work, regardless of "extras." It makes me wonder the point of it. Reality is, when I'm paying commercially, it most certainly is about me. Even if the fantasy is that it's about her. It goes right along with denial, pain or humiliation being sexual. The fantasy, the mind, makes it sexual where most would find it bizarre, pathetic or idiotic.

Pro Dommes are well-aware that what they do gives their clients sexual pleasure (and those of us who don't want to have sex or give hand jobs to our clients are no exception). And often what we do in session gives us sexual gratification, even if it doesn't look "sexual" to the vanilla world (or to the client). Not a single Domme is saying she doesn't want her sessions to be hot or sexy. Some of us are only saying that we don't do X, Y, and/or Z in our sessions (and that you're welcome to do whatever you want in sessions with someone else).

The best sessions ever are the ones where the desires of the sub are matched with the true desires of the Domme. If you expect a level of contact beyond that which the Domme cares to establish, look for someone else. Beyond that it doesn't really matter whether anyone thinks it's "sex" or not. Kinky folk are well-known for having "sex" that doesn't involve inserting cocks into pussies.

Miss Grey

I think if you read prodomination boards frequently, some prodommes are saying exactly that! They deny they are sex workers, they claim prodommes who do what they won't aren't genuine. They offer things as illegal as other things but claim they don't do xyz because of legalities as opposed to preference. It's the blatant hypocrisy that irks me, not what they will or won't do. I've seen plenty of rigid, no nonsense, non seductive prodommes. Sometimes those are my best sessions and exactly what I'm seeking. Sometimes not.

One thing I like about this board is some of the posters not afraid to call, "bullshit." There's a lot out there.

The fact of the matter is that many (indeed, probably most) "no-sex" prodommes regard acts that they are willing to perform as being perfectly legal, while acts that they are not willing to perform are denigrated as "prostitution," and those who are willing to perform them are derided as being "prostitutes."

But another fact of the matter is that prostitution is established by law. It is created in law, it is made a crime in law, and what constitutes prostitution in a given state is defined in that state's law. (And by "law" I mean both statutes and court interpretations thereof.) A number of activities that "no-sex" prodommes regard as being perfectly above board and legal do, in fact, fit within the definition of "lewd act" under California law (and the equivalent in every other state), and, consequently, doing them in return for some consideration is just as much an act of prostitution as BJ or FS in the eyes of the law, which, after all, is the only thing that matters.

Boundaries are not the issue. It is every provider's prerogative to set her boundaries, and they should be respected by clients. It is the gross hypocrisy of so many "no-sex" prodommes that is disgusting.

And I too have seen both types, and will continue to do so, depending on what I'm looking for at a given time. I'm fine with both types being available. What I am not fine with is the gross hypocrisy spouted by many "no-sex" sex workers.

This is a most cogent point!

Thank you.

Miss Grey

man this entire conversation gets so polictial..point is that if you want something bad enough your buy it, or find a way to get it.

just like buying a electronic these days, it always is missing one feature you want, so you either have to buy it seperatley....

And therein lies the rub. Within the client/provider rubric, as the emotional bond grows (typically on the client's part), the provider can never really give the emotional depth the client needs- whether for self preservation or the realities of doing business, she/he must distance themselves to some degree emotionally- you can't love everyone. The client can intellectualize this, but hearts and minds often run in differing directions.

Easy to be hard, easy to be cruel. But it's tough to truly bond in a BDSM context and keep emotional distance.