I posted a poll in the general category to which the vast majority of guys say that giving out personal info or references is a turn off, and potentially a deal breaker and won't call you at all. On behalf of these guys, I'd like to ask you to post your response telling us what information you personally require and -- more importantly -- why? And if you are one that requires an RB handle, please answer what you typically do with that information.

Finally, please tell us what a provider reference is used for? Do you actually call that provider? What routine questions do you ask? And then the million dollar question that most guys are confused about...how does our giving you a provider reference a means "for your protection" as you seem to claim in your ads?

I hope you gals can be clear and detailed in your answers because truly a lot of guys are very paranoid by your screening process. And it would be helpful if you shed some light on this matter.

Again, just the providers who routinely require references need post their responses. Thanks.

A provider reference is helpful as she can tell me if he is safe, a gentleman and would she see him again. I also do a little homework on the provider giving the reference, check her reviews to see if they look legit. Search the boards to get a feel for both of their character if he does have an rb handle.

A rb handle is helpful as well if you have reviewed other providers and inbox me from the handle. The inbox assure you really are the handle you gave me and shows how long you have been a member of rb, it shows that you are indeed a hobbyist. I can also read your reviews to see your likes and dislikes before we meet.

For gentlemen that do not have references I have other methods of screening that require a little personal info.

You asked how a reference is means for our personal safety, I think that should be obvious. Some one has vouched for you, I know that you have sessioned with her and behaved yourself like a gentleman.

Men who have bad intentions, rapes, robs and or just want to prolong a phone conversation pretending to schedule a session so they can rub one out are pretty much avoided by screening. Most of the bad guys hang up or say "ok let me look her up and I will call you back" but never do.

I know that there are men that will see that I screen and keep on looking, however there are also men who will only see ladies that screen because they feel safer knowing she exercises a little caution in who she gives her location to and spends time with. I prefer to have some pass me up because I screen than to have several flakes a day or run the risk of a bad situation.

As far as the information given to me, no I do not save it. Once you are screened I no longer need the info to keep it would be silly. If you too do your homework before choosing and calling a provider you can learn much about her and choose wisely. Do a search on her handle on the boards to get a feel for her personality and character. Read her reviews and see what others say about her. That should help to ease some of the nervousness regarding giving her information to clear screening.

After all this is a very personal business some personal information is not to much to ask, and on your part it is a good show of faith and we are both taking a little risk in meeting someone new not just the provider! If you watch the news you know bad things happen every day, our odds of a bad thing happening are increased ten fold as we meet strangers in a private setting. Asking for a little info before hand is smart and in my book necessary!

If I suck it they will cum! ®

If a guy is paranoid then he should just contact someone who doesn't require a reference or an RB Handle. Why go see someone when the first 10 to 15 Minutes will be just trying to calm your nerves.

The fact that a man showed up with hunting knife, and luggage is enough reason for me to think references are necessary.

Hi Chuckie

So, anyway. I'm with you, 7th storehouse -- I wish that we didn't have to screen. It is a pain, and it takes time away from other things I would rather be doing, like taking long walks on the beach, having interesting conversations, and making out. However, it also takes time away from other things that I do NOT want to be doing, like confronting my client about a shorted donation, worrying about the safety of the HOME where I LIVE, defending my personal physical and emotional safety, and planning my life around someone who is just going to flake. Maybe you'll think I'm being melodramatic if I play the "serial rapist" card, but in fact there are several active guys out there who do that -- one in the East Bay where I live, and I have been following the reports of his violence ever since I got into this business. Who even knows if he's only a rapist -- I'm not sure how we'd know if his victim didn't get away to tell the story. If for no other reason, I want to know that you are not him!

Notice that I didn't even mention LE yet!

And speaking of LE, that brings me to another point. If sex work were legal and socially acceptable and treated with the respect it deserves, a provider would be able to take legal action against someone if they stole from her or didn't pay her. It would be easier to collect a cancellation fee for a flake. How about rape? Taking action against a rapist is tricky even when it happens in a civilian situation. And do we want to take action against a rapist? No! We don't want to get that far. We don't want it to happen at all, thank you very much.

Sex workers get blamed for every bad thing that happens to them. They are told that if they're going to be in this business that they are opening the door to all kinds of bad things happening to them and they should just accept it or find a different job. Well, I for one do believe that I am in charge of my destiny and my happiness, and NOT leaving my door wide open to everyone in the whole wide world is a way that I take responsibility. Some of you seem to want to frame it like we're out to get you or something, but really for most of us it's about doing what we have to do to be able to continue doing that wonderful thing that we do.

When I contact a provider to follow up on a reference, I am not looking for personal information. I want to know "is he safe, is he polite and respectful, would you see him again?" That is all. I don't ask about penis size (I don't want to know!) I don't ask about how old you are or your job or your marital status or any other thing. All of that stuff actually falls into the "have better ways to spend my time" category.

I have additional ways that I sometimes screen people, based on what they are comfortable sharing or how motivated they are to prove themselves to me. I am not going to go into that appendix because I reserve that for those who actually want to see me. Provider reference seems like the most innocuous, straightforward process.

Also I wish that someone could compile a list of posts on this topic from over the years because it is probably in the list of the top five things we talk about on Redbook. Why am I ranting yet again??? LOL

What I would like to offer is my reason that I am Red Book Reference only, and give you an overview of the process:

With a RB reference, I am able to speak with an established RB lady who has spent time with you. This will tell me how the man will treat me. It does NOT tell me your last name, where you work/live/drivers license#.

Usually the conversation is very brief: "Hi, I'm...and looking for a reference on a "Mike", his cell# (or sometimes just the last 4 digits), he said he visited you approximately...ago. And you would remember him by...(something you two spoke of or a situation which occurred-road work on her street, or an occupation, or a physical description).

She will check the number and then confirm or deny whether he has seen her. "Is he safe and respectful?" Usually a "yes" and I thank her for her time.

Occasionally, I may get a warning that he may have a tendency to be a boundary-pusher, either physically, or with the session time. Or maybe his donation was short when she counted and his reaction to this.(We all understand that errors happen)

If it was an unsafe session, she will usually tell me she will not see him again or recommend him and then she will usually give me specific detail as to what occurred.

When a gentleman contacts me, I request the providers Ad # (I prefer this because the names must be spelled exactly, and sometimes their cell# is not the one listed in Ad.) I look up the Ad, and make sure she has credible reviews.

Each reference can be very time consuming. Many ladies are not able to give a reference immediately (we all have our own schedules) It can take a lot of follow-up contacting in-boxes, emails, voice mails, texts) Two days later I may get a call from a young gal "hi, you called on a reference?" then not want to tell me who she is! (Of course you won't always have all info in front of you each time) And usually there a several references pending at any given time, so recalling the names, handles of Hobbyists AND Providers can get daunting.

Hope this gives you a little insight on our end! ~Safire

Hugs and Kisses!
Amee

Dear xxxx:

In an ongoing effort to keep our community safe, I require a reputable provider reference from all new clients.

Your name has been offered by the client below. I would greatly appreciate the following information:

Did he honor his commitments?
Did he respect your boundaries?

Client:
Name:
Email:
Phone:
Additional information offered by client:

Sincerely
Juliette
www.JDalry.com
http://classifieds.myredbook.com/classified.php?uname=gds_Juliette

Bottom line on references:
Clients have reviews to confirm our reputation so they don't get assaulted, arrested or ripped off. We're just leveling the playing field.

Reference Myths:

UNTRUE:
"My ATF will cut me off/be mad/get jealous"
If your ATF has actually gone off on you about this and is this possessive you need to stop seeing her right now. She is crazy nuts.
If you just think, fantasize, or imagine that this will happen then you need a reality check. We all know that you see many other girls. That's why you do this. Plus, most of us who are sane know that what goes around comes around.

"I could get blackmailed"
Seriously? First, see above about reality check & fantasies about self-importance. But if you are a politician or a Fortune 500 CEO, or just paranoid, the ways to remain anonymous have been discussed so many times that the redundancy is nauseating: Make up one fake name, keep a disposable phone in your desk drawer at work. See one girl who doesn't request references OR choose someone with a great reputation and give her your info. Reference accomplished.

"Hookers will share info that I don't want out there"
Again, seriously? Reality check: you may want to believe we spend every minute of every day thinking about and talking about your cock. Sorry, we don't. References are "is he safe, does he show up & pay."

SOMEWHAT TRUE BUT:
"It takes too long."
If you are a same day client, yes but you can get pre-cleared by most girls.

"It's a pain in the ass"
Possibly. It's more than a pain in the ass for the girl if she gets murdered, assaulted, arrested, or ripped off.

"It doesn't protect the girl"
Yes, someone can pretend to be nice to one girl. But if he hurts someone she referenced, she'll find out and that's the end of that. It's not perfect, but it dramatically reduces the danger. Just like reviews dramatically reduce a client's risk of getting ripped off or beaten up by a pimp.

I typically ask for your first name (real or fake), a cell phone number (pre-paid or not), an email address and a reference from a provider that has recent reviews. I ask for the name, number and email address so I can give them to the provider when I verify the reference and so I can contact you to confirm the date. I ask for the reference for a number of reasons...

To make sure you aren't a kid playing 'send an escort to the neighbors house'. To make sure you are a reliable person that is serious about setting up the date and will not flake on me. To make sure that you have at least once behaved appropriately with another lady (paid her, didn't abuse her, showed up clean or took a shower with out complaining, didn't attempt to seal from her, didn't push for services that I do not want to do, etc).

I do verify the reference via her preferred method of contact and I ask her if she has met the man and did she consider him to be a safe and respectful client. Most ladies and booking agents don't go into more detail.

Sometimes I will use another screening method and tend to be fairly creative with them... the basic idea is just to do my best to make myself comfortable in the idea that the man isn't a cop, is serious about the date, and can treat a provider decently.

I also do accept review handles as a reference sometimes... I look up the reviewers history and look for red flags just like the clients do or contact a provider I am familiar with from the list when possible and do the same basic reference check.

I understand that some clients find references or screening to be invasive or whatever... they do not have to partake. Just like they do not have to see an unreviewed lady and take the chance at being robed, flaked on, subjected to an uncomfortable situation like b&s or simply not having a good time. I do not have to take the risk of seeing a man that is unwilling or unable to provide a reference or screen in some way and take the risk of being flaked on, treated poorly, have my time wasted, robbed, etc. There are options out there for all of us and some are more willing/able to take larger risks than others.

Love . Ireland . xoxo

I didn't know how important this was when I was new. All it took was going to a couple of nasty,dirty apartments (in surprisingly decent areas of Sacramento) or driving an hour to an outcall - only to go to voicemail at the freeway offramp a couple of times - to realize why calling another provider to check on whether a client was "cool" or not - was so damn important.

I call the girl's numbers provided by the gentleman who wishes to see me. I tell her the handle/name given by the hobbyist and ask what she remembers about him. Was he a gentleman? Was he kind? What was his hygine like? If a girl gives positive answers to all these questions - it's a GO. I've never wasted my time/lost income/been grossed out if I just checked the references of a potential outcall.

We check references to see if the provider felt SAFE and was pleased with the session overall.

We check on the guys for almost the same reasons the guys check on us. The only difference is that the majority of us aren't so interested in whether you are good-looking or not.

It's a bonus if you are - but if she's a good provider and just a nice person it's not a problem if the hobbyist not what would be generally considered "attractive".

We do ask what you look like to make sure that the nice, black guy the provider remembers having such a great time with - doesn't turn out to be a white guy with a beard like ZZ Top's front man.

When you see the difference in her description vs. the guy who opens the door - you realize you could have a potential problem because - if you choose to follow through with the date - you are entering a session with NO information - on HIS territory. Scary.

Personally, I've had some fantastic,sexually satisfying sessions with men who were in NO way tradtionally attractive.

Conversely, if a guy is a jerk, has breath like he licked an ashtray right before our session along with the onion sandwich he ate for lunch and/or body smells bad - I don't care HOW good he is to look at! However, if a gentleman is truly a gentleman - has a nice personality, exceptional hygine and minty-fresh breath he gets WAAAAY more mileage than a fella who doesn't pay attention to "the details."

xoxo Summer

I know that if I'm going into a session worrying about whether the client will respect me, I'm not going to perform as well. Even if he's a perfectly nice guy, the quality of his session, at least the first ten minutes of it, will be diminished. I'm not saying I was a total mess before I started screening, just that I didn't greet a client with a warm hug and long sexy kiss at the door. Now, that connection can be instant because there's no worry at all.

Besides how it will effect the session, the major reason is personal safety. There is no amount of money that would compel me to risk my life. Sex workers get beaten up, raped, and murdered by their clients. That might seem far-fetched and abstract, but it is the unfortunate truth. When I go to the events for International Day to End Violence Against Sex Workers, I listen to them read the list of all the sex workers who have been murdered in the past year. Every year that reminds me not to get lazy.

The third reason is similar to the reason many clients don't want to provide a reference. I have too much to lose. Clients might assume that sex workers don't have as much to lose as they do. It's just not true for all of us. We have families. We have other careers. We may have a current or future professional license on the line. Again, there is no amount of money that would compel me to risk all of that. Therefore, I understand clients who don't want to give me their personal information. I require a real name and either verifiable employment information or a scan/picture of their driver's license. I happen to be extremely trustworthy. Not everyone knows that. I don't resent clients who won't provide that information; it is quite a leap of faith. It's a leap of faith that I require, and if that means I have relatively few clients, so be it. I imagine that as I acquire more references that leap of faith will be less, and business will pick up a bit.

Now, I'm only able to say that because I'm in a privileged position. My rates are high so having relatively few clients works just fine. I'm also in graduate school, so I only have time for two per week. I'm not getting rich, but I'm making a living. I'd rather be safe with a moderate income than injured/raped/dead and rolling in money.